oris
Tijekom 70-ih, u prvom dijelu svog profesionalnog života, uglavnom ste se bavili konceptualnim projektima, predavanjima, istraživanjem, pisanjem i razmišljanjem o osnovama arhitekture. Na neki način vaš je angažman bio blizak duhu vremena i to ne samo u arhitekturi. Bilo je to razdoblje napredovanja konceptualne umjetnosti i odmaka od konvencionalnih umjetničkih artefakata prema drugačijem poimanju umjetničke prakse.

tschumi
Možda to i jest bio duh vremena, no možda je to uključivalo i više od toga. Doista je postojala potreba upitati se što arhitektura točno jest. Drugim riječima, u 20. je stoljeću prvo postojao niz sigurnih stvari uspostavljenih izjavama koje je iznio moderni pokret u pokušaju definiranja što je arhitektura. Te su se sigurne stvari pokazale nekako neizvedivima. Naime, možda su obećavale dosta, ali su omogućavale vrlo malo. Uzmite, na primjer, način na koji su projektirane gradske četvrti – ti su se gradovi pokazali neizvedivima. Nisu ispunili obećanja u smislu socijalnog, kulturološkog ni nekog drugog konteksta.

oris
U tom je trenutku modernistički pokret bio djelomično zaokupljen i korporativnom arhitekturom; njegova je avangardna pozicija bila izgubljena, dok su utopistički ideali dovedeni u pitanje.

tschumi
Ako pomislite na Francusku i nove gradove oko Pariza, arhitektura je bila dosta korporativna, pa čak i birokratska. Nedostatak kredibiliteta arhitekture 60-ih godina značio je da sam osjetio da se stvari mogu radikalno propitati. Počeo sam raditi ne iz središta arhitekture, nego na njenim marginama. Sagledao sam druge discipline tražeći poveznicu s arhitektonskim interesima ili pitanjima. U pokušaju učenja arhitekture kroz rubove, kroz margine, okrenuo sam se umjetnosti, filozofiji, matematici, kinematografiji, itd. U to doba mog rada odista sam provodio istraživanja kroz pisanje, kroz teoretske crteže, teoretske projekte kao što su Manhattan Transcripts, Screenplays, Manifestos i tako dalje. I tako je sve počelo.
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oris
During the first part of your professional life in the seventies, you were mostly involved with conceptual projects, with teaching, research, writing and reflecting on the fundaments of architecture. In a way, your engagement was close to the spirit of the time, not only in architecture. It was a period of growth of conceptual art and shift away from artistic artefact to different notions of artistic practices.

tschumi
Maybe it was the spirit of the time, but maybe it was more than that. There was really a need to question what architecture was all about. In other words, throughout the 20th century, there had been first a number of certainties that were established through the statements made by the modern movement, trying to define what architecture was. Think of Le Corbusier and the five points of architecture. These certainties had proved somehow not workable. Namely, it may have promised a lot but delivered very little. Take the way the new city quarters were designed, these cities proved to be not workable. They did not fulfil their promises in terms of social, cultural and other contexts.

oris
At that moment, the modern movement was also partly absorbed in corporate architecture, its avant-garde position was lost and the utopian ideals were brought under the question.

tschumi
Architecture was quite corporate and even bureaucratic, if you think of France and the new towns around Paris. The lack of credibility of architecture at the time in the sixties meant that I felt that things had to be questioned radically and started to work not within the centre of architecture, but on the margins. I looked at other disciplines, searching where the connection point was with architectural concerns or questions. I was interested in art, literature, philosophy, mathematics, cinema etc. trying to learn about architecture through the edges, through the margins. So much of the exploration at the time of the work that I did was indeed through writing, through theoretical drawings, theoretical projects, like the Manhattan Transcripts, like the Screenplays, like the Manifestos and so on. And that’s how it all started.
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